Im starting to think that you're not a poker retard, but just have difficulty in reading comprehension. You keep repeating yourself, but not replying to my explanation. I have told you that i do play Aces and Jacks the same way the MAJORITY OF THE TIME. Read above and try to go slow so you see where i explained that. Also read above where I told you this was a player dependant play. I raise with Aces there 98% of the freaking time. So stop jerking off your self proclaimed poker knowledge long enough to smell the beef jerky, SASQUATCH.

And really stop pretending you could do anything at this game. If you could, then go rob your grnadma for some money and get on the table. Oh wait, you've been on the table, got bored and gave all your money to these people you call clownfish. You are right there with peter pan and many others super-stars in their own head who think they can crush the 1-2 but aint got no dough. play your .10/.20 for a few months, save enough to get on that table you doofus, id love to take your money.

Posted By: DodgingDonkeys I have told you that i do play Aces and Jacks the same way the MAJORITY OF THE TIME. Read above and try to go slow so you see where i explained that. Also read above where I told you this was a player dependant play. I raise with Aces there 98% of the freaking time. So stop jerking off your self proclaimed poker knowledge

And really stop pretending you could do anything at this game. If you could, then go rob your grnadma for some money and get on the table. Oh wait, you've been on the table, got bored and gave all your money to these people you call clownfish. You are right there with peter pan and many others super-stars in their own head who think they can crush the 1-2 but aint got no dough. play your .10/.20 for a few months, save enough to get on that table you doofus, id love to take your money.

my question was initially related to what you do with jacks after the flop...you still havent answered that. like if you flat there or c/r the flop with jacks? also i cant beleive tok folded kings here, im still amazed. especillay if you do in fact c/r jacks. which would lead me to beleive that 99+ is in your c/r range, which he is far ahead of. if you c/c jacks on this flop then you must do it with aces, that was my point.

as for the rest of this post... why do i want to sit next to a bunch of cramped droolers at a ten handed table seeing 1 hand every 2 minutes? if you guys ever want to play 6 max tables id be more than willing to play that game cause it might be the slightest bit faster but im certainly not playing 10 handed.

id rather sit home, eat a gallon of peanut butter and try to induce vomitting.

Posted By: areaman
my question was initially related to what you do with jacks after the flop...you still havent answered that.

Ahh. I am starting to see the problem with our communication. Let me recap our thread:

<areaman> lemme ask you this.....what do you do with JJ in this spot assuming you flat the raise from philly...?

<Scuba>Why do you ask me about jacks areaman? If i had jacks, i re-raise Philly, and Tok put in the third raise, I get away from the hand, unless i have enough odds to set mine.

<areaman>if you always reraise jacks there then what the fuck are you doing not reraising aces?
dont you ever flat jacks here?
you must get blown off a lot of hands preflop making 3 bets, thats kinda spewy, dont you think?



Can you see the miscommunication for yourself? We were talking pre-flop areaman. You never asked me about jacks post-flop. And the question of this thread was pre-flop play. Philly only raised pre-flop, so it is clear with my posts, im talking pre-flop. You never specified post-flop!!!

And if you READ my posts on this thread, you will see that I stated i clearly made a mistake with not leading out with Aces on the FLOP here. I clearly stated that, but i didnt want to focus on the flop play. my question was could i have got it all in against Tok pre-flop. not against a random player. Not KNOWING tok had kings. But guessing he had Kings or Queens. Boy, i feel like im wasting my energy here.

Posted By: areaman<areaman> lemme ask you this.....what do you do with JJ in this spot assuming you flat the raise from philly...?


this assumes post flop play, you have flatted a raise from philly, call a 3 bet from tok, i thought it was clear. thats what i was alluding to. i didnt think youd fold to a 3bet from tok with JJ. whatever. youre right, its my fault. i could care less to be honest.

re-read the OP. Philly checked the flop. His raise was pre-flop.

Here's my two cents:

I agree with Philly here, I think a re-raise preflop is good. I won't say it's always the right play, but I think it is here. I really hate cold calling a three bet when I wasn't the original raiser, no matter what my hand is. I think it's a lot less concealed than people think it is. If someone has 0 money invested in the pot, and all of a sudden they are willing to put in fifty without raising my alarms start going off. Especially if it's a good player, as Scuba is...because I know he's not in there with A/J suited in this spot. Cold calling one raise with aces is a lot more deceptive because your range of hands is a lot bigger. If the stacks are really deep, A/K is a hand I will consider doing that with, but even so...I think it usually puts you in a really awkward spot. Tok is capable of mucking Kings I guess, but will he? Eh, I don't think he mucks Kings preflop in this spot. He says he would, but then again he tells you he had a set everytime too, so who knows really?

If Tok is going to dump Kings here, which I will say again I don't think he would preflop, then why try to trap him postflop where he is not going to want to put money in the pot unless he's caught up to you? With all the money in the pot, I think you have to bank on one of the two players having a hand they can play for all the chips with...or you have to be just happy with taking down 50 blinds, which is pretty okay. I think to play the hand this way, it's a little backwards, because you know Tok has a BIG hand, but of course you're beating him...so not only are you letting Tok get possibly scared off by the flop, but you are allowing Philly to either outflop you or bluff you as well. Because as he said, his range is basically infinite here.

The goal of poker, as I believe I have heard you say before Scuba, is to make good decisions. I think when you play the hand this way preflop, you make it easier for yourself to make a mistake postflop. I don't mind flatting the re-raise if you raise initially and Tok re-raises and it's a heads up pot. I think there's a lot of deception in that play, but in this case I just don't think it was played optimally.

But hey, after how bad I played Aces on pokerstars this morning...I can assure you, this is only meant to be constructive criticism, because I can be a real fucking idiot sometimes.